[FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Support for UP Software. To report a bug, post with a title [BUG REPORT]. To request a feature, post with a title [FEATURE REQUEST]
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scubamatt41
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[FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by scubamatt41 » Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:29 pm

Hello,

Maybe it's already in the UP software but is it possible to get a preview of the support as calculated, for the respective loaded object?
Always breath out on the way UP

eyUP
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by eyUP » Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:48 pm

+1
Preview is a feature I'd really like to see and am always getting asked for from UP! customers.
One of the main benefits would be it's educational value and getting immediate feedback after changing parameters...
There would be less need to keep printing and wasting material just to see if the support is going to work or the fill is dense enough etc.
It wouldn't be that big job to add to the software IMO.

roller
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by roller » Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:08 am

+1 too

I agree being able to see support would be great to be able to intercept issues before starting printing.

ahd71
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by ahd71 » Thu Jan 03, 2013 8:08 am

+1

likya
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by likya » Thu Feb 14, 2013 9:47 am

+1 , it will be really time-saving , sometimes DAY saving !

roller
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by roller » Fri Feb 15, 2013 3:05 am

+1 it's also an excellent learning tool to learning what settings will do as well as the time saving of not wasting print with unnecessary or inadequate support.

eyUP
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by eyUP » Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:05 am

I'm beginning to wonder if the nozzle's path (ie, offsetting the shell, creating support and fill structures) is calculated on the board and not on the host PC, therefore drawing a preview on screen wouldn't be that trivial and would involve a lot more USB data traffic.
I say this after reading about someone using a low powered netbook to run the UP! printer and the speed of calculation was still fast, especially compared to open-source slicing s/w on the same PC.
Maybe the host just slices up the model and sends those down to the board for further processing ?

Just out of interest, does anyone know ?

D3rax
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by D3rax » Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:16 am

According to the manual, the calculationpreview of the printtime and the weight of the model, that shows up before you start the print, displays the weight of the model including the added support. I've not checked this, but if this is true it looks to me that the calculation of the supportmaterial should already be done in the Up! software itself, before sending the model to the printer?
Up! Plus

mr6k
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by mr6k » Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:21 pm

The support is already shown on the UP plus software, well version 1.16 which I run. I just drew an object that had obvious overhangs if I oriented it in a particular way. Laying it on the UP software with no overhang I got a print preview weight of 5.5 grams and no yellow outline on the base area. Laying it so it needed maximum support I get a weight of 9.3 Grams and the area of support on the base shows as a yellow outlined area with some fill lines. I agree it does not show the support vertically but it can be assumed that the base line area will extrapolate up to the real object area that is being supported.

Or are you all referring to support that does not originate at the base but only between certain vertical layers, such as the letter E standing up on the printer, I tried this and agree there is no indication of support between the lower/middle or middle/upper strut of the E. I did not try to print it so do not know, if in reality, it would create support.

As I tend to build engineering parts I have not suffered from this so far as anything complex that may suffer from support I tend to print as seperate items and weld with ABS.

cheers

Peter

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scubamatt41
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by scubamatt41 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:01 pm

Hi all

With 'preview of calculated support' I refer to the preview similar to what you get in AXON. Software that I used on my bfb rapman. In there I got a preview of the model with the support or lack of it. It can safe you a lot of filament. :)
Always breath out on the way UP

eyUP
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by eyUP » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:32 pm

This is the kind of thing I think would be great...with the ability to view the slices to see exactly what is going to happen...
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scubamatt41
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by scubamatt41 » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:01 pm

Just what I mean eyUP ;)
Always breath out on the way UP

pleppik
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by pleppik » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:51 pm

eyUP wrote:Maybe the host just slices up the model and sends those down to the board for further processing ?

Just out of interest, does anyone know ?
I don't know for certain, but this sounds really unlikely to me, based on what I've seen of the behavior of the software. As others have noted, the "preview" output gives you the material used including the support and raft, which wouldn't be possible if the support was calculated on board the printer. Also, I've seen differences between how the Mac and PC versions of the software will print the same model, which I wouldn't expect if the toolpath generation happened on the printer.

I suspect the performance difference between Up and open source printers when slicing is because of some combination of:

1) Most of the open source slicers are written in dog-slow scripting languages like Python, instead of compiled to machine code. Python really isn't designed for number crunching, and is a really strange choice for this application. Makerbot now has a closed, proprietary, and compiled slicer, and my limited experience is that it's way better than the open source slicers but still way behind the Up.

2) The Gcode which open source printers use to describe the toolpath is fairly verbose and low-level. It literally describes every action the printer has to take, in plain text, from moving the print head to turning heaters on and off. It's good for a fairly simple DIY machine without much onboard intelligence, but it's possible to design something a lot more efficient if you have the option of putting a little more software on the machine and you aren't locked into Gcode.

3) It's also possible that the Up slicer also has a smarter, more efficient slicing algorithm. Their parent company has had many years and dedicated engineering resources to devote to this, and they may have found some very clever shortcuts.

roller
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by roller » Sat Feb 16, 2013 1:10 am

eyUP wrote:I'm beginning to wonder if the nozzle's path (ie, offsetting the shell, creating support and fill structures) is calculated on the board and not on the host PC, therefore drawing a preview on screen wouldn't be that trivial and would involve a lot more USB data traffic.
I say this after reading about someone using a low powered netbook to run the UP! printer and the speed of calculation was still fast, especially compared to open-source slicing s/w on the same PC.
Maybe the host just slices up the model and sends those down to the board for further processing ?
Having built a lot of printers and looked at the guts of my Mini while I had it, I can tell you for certain it will be all calculated in the software completely and sent to the printer as a set of movements. The printer MB is really just a fancy motor controller like any CNC unit and will not calculate things like support.

troy
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by troy » Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:07 pm

Is there any UPdate on this request??

I have UP Plus 2 (Rom:v6.090, Firmware v3.07, UP! Version 2.0) and cant find this feature anywhere.... This sure would save a LOT of time...

Surely there is a developer mode or something that the UP! software can be run in to show the full support structures? Maybe a magic developer hidden command line option??

The little bit of yellow at the base of the model after a print preview is insufficient...

Please add this feature or tell us how to access it.

Thanks
_troy

roller
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by roller » Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:42 am

Is there any UPdate on this request??
There are many requests which have sat for years without being implemented and this one has been mentioned before it started in this thread. We never know which if any feature requests we make will be implemented until they pop up in software.

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JuliaDee
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Re: [FEATURE REQUEST] preview of calculated support

Post by JuliaDee » Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:09 am

I suggested this about 14 months ago but I'll voice my desire/support (ha) for it again.

julia

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