Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Share your experience with UP300!
cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:26 am

Hi All,

Anyone with an UP300, please add to this wishlist. We might not see any of this, but it's worth wishing for - :) Wishes don't have to be practical... It's just fun looking at such a cool product and thinking, "Wouldn't it be great if it could also do this?"...

Feel free to disagree with my suggestions also.

I'll start, Please enumerate (add numbers to) each line for others to reference for discussion and continue on from the last number mentioned.

Most of these could be an upgrade to the existing model, so don't really need to be

1) An "Off" or "Sleep" button on the front panel, so we can put it to bed at night... Better still if this reduces power consumption slightly ( though they don't take up much power when not operating ) - But even just turning the front light off would be a good start, and it could wake up on tapping the screen.

2) A dehumidifier or heater option for the filament cabinet. Since the cabinet is sealed and out of the way, very little would have to be changed to support this - either a "bake the filament" option which raises the filament container temperature to around 80 or 90 degrees for a time, and perhaps even to have a dessicant slot - or put some rice next to the air intake of the hot air blower. This is kind of an advanced idea, but would allow a "prebake" of the filament ahead of using the printer if it's been unused for some time... Or perhaps just seal the compartment entirely and drop the dessicant from the filament packet in there after loading. This would go a long way towards maintaining filament quality on less-used machines or machines that sit idle for extended periods before going back into operation.

3) An auto-filament feed in the compartment. Honestly, this is something the UP300 actually needs so I'll design and make one myself - something that ratchets easily in one direction, but can feed with a one-way bearing, so that I only have to push in the filament in the compartment and it will automatically feed it until about 5cm is protruding from the end of the feed line. Pushing filament into the hole at the top is very hard - there's no room to work, and I've found the compartment often causes the filament to skip and roll around the axle, which will lead to print failure. Wouldn't it be nice to just lift the filament into the hole, where it is grabbed and automatically fed through?

4) Filament wipe - A small sponge that clips on to the bottom of the filament line and wipes dirt from the filament if the filament has any dust on it.

5) Anti-skip fingers - Something that prevents the filement on a new roll from falling off the roll and winding around the axle, "skipping" the roll. That has happened to me often in the past. Could be just about anything that prevents this... I'm not really sure of the best solution.

6) Bed Pre-heat MANUAL OVERRIDE... Don't start pre-heating the bed when we hit print... Allow us to do it when we want, and pre-heat the bed while we're still playing around with setting up the print, deciding on infill and generally preparing things. The bed takes a long time to pre-heat and there's no reason we couldn't have a BED PRE-HEAT manual option that just starts it's baking in the background.. Include an auto-off after 30 minutes just in case we forget. 30 minutes is a LONG time to get things ready. The head heats up quickly, so there's no need for this for the head. ( I know the bed can be pre-heated on print, but a manual override to kick things off would be nice ).

7) Leave the lights on... I do actually like that they go off, but it would be nice, sometimes, to say "leave the lights on" inside the UP300. I don't think this should be a default behavior - just an option.

8) Auto tray changing and stacking for multiple prints... Nah, I'm just kidding about that one. That's the X5.

9) Thin wall printing. Because some times you just want a single line of plastic, with no fill. Current minimum wall with the UP300 is about 0.9mm but it would be nice if that could go down to 0.4mm as a special option.

10) Show layer and MM height on the front panel. Because we're all impatient and like to watch where things are at... :)

11) Change print speed interactively from the front panel during print ( is this even possible? ) Like a +/- 50% option.

12) Coffee cup holder/warmer behind the display... ( OK, maybe not such a good idea that one ).

13) Onscreen notes from the model -That is, could we embed notes with a model so that when we're printing, it displays a short note?

14) Manual setting of the printer IP address for printing outside of the current network segment :)

15) Being able to see just the support detail or the model detail in the print preview... and being able to manually remove support material from the model ( eg, click on a piece of support material and remove it from the print ). Automatic is great and all, but sometimes you need support but don't want it everywhere and there is such a thing as "too smart" when it comes to software. UPStudio is a bit too simple.

16) Model-has-come-loose detection. No idea how you're going to do this one... But it would be nice to have a "shut down on any problem" -

17) A tool to clean the print head of burnt material, so it doesn't flake off onto white models :( ( one guess why I thought of this ).

18) A wipe at the side of the printer to scrape off any dags prior to printing since they don't always come off when printing the first strip that it prints to make sure the plastic is ready to extrude.

I'll think of some more - :)

David

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 564
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:50 am

Re (6) Manual heat, if the UP300 runs the same way as the other TT printers then this can be triggered via the software. It's not obvious but if you click this icon it will turn on bed heating.
TT heat.PNG
TT heat.PNG (39.07 KiB) Viewed 1434 times
Re (16) Model-has-come-loose detection. My Markforged calls this "Dislocation Detection". I don't know how they do it, but it works. (This isn't the expensive one with the built in laser scanner but the cheaper one.) I'd love TT to implement this.

New (19) Filament Jam detection. I've been moaning about this for years. My printers never run out of filament (I weigh the roll before printing) but they do jam; frequently. So the filament detection sensor is pointless... All the printer sees is that there is filament present so it air prints for a whole weekend. Personally I'd do it with a rotary encoder so it's not really a FW request, but I would class it as essential on a serious printer.

New (20) Email notifications. I want my printer to tell me if it has finished or if it detects a problem. That way I can ask someone to go and look at it if I'm not in work.

New (21) Bi-directional GCODE support. I don't want to use Studio to send GCODE to the printer. I want to use S3D to control the printer start to finish.

Cheers,

Owen S.

floridawilson844
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:58 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by floridawilson844 » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:02 am

I really appreciate the topic which you discussed over here. I spent a whole day trying to Upgrades and Firmware revisions for my printer. When I saw your website, I got relief that I wasn’t the only one. Recently i have been faced issues while i try to give a command to the printer to print some document then it give error then i took assistance from Printer is in an Error State[/url] team and they assisted me perfectly to resolve my issues.

BigE79
Posts: 40
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:18 pm

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by BigE79 » Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:41 am

Pretty sure for #9 this is in the advanced print options as "Thin Wall".

22) Be able to change how well the supports hold to the model (bottom of supports). I keep finding the supports falling over because the bottom of the supports touches the model not raft or build plate. It uses a too delicate setting for this and the supports can fall over (even using stable support option). Would be good to be able to adjust this.

23) Light icon on the touch screen, not just pause.

24) More detailed manual with information like how to change the filters, maintenance etc.

25) 1KG rolls of ABS and ABS+ available is more colours. I can only find black and white.

26) Able to dim front display back-light.

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Wed Nov 07, 2018 7:20 am

Hi BigE79 - thanks for the suggestion - I'll give it a try.
Re #23, if you touch the touchpanel anywhere other than the pause button, it turns on the light. This might not be what you're asking though.

Also, I must have been asleep - what is ABS+ ?

27) Ability to read STL or 3UP files directly from the USB stick port.

28) Ability to set static IP addresses for LAN and WIFI without having to have a connection first.

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 564
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Wed Nov 07, 2018 8:23 am

It might be worth adding a rating to the requests so TT can prioritize work.

In another supplier I favour their forum allows users to vote on the requests so they know where to focus their "3 week development sprints". So every 3 weeks we get new tools, and more often than not they're the things we've asked for... Who-da-thunk?

They also ask for a bit of feedback on the benefits of each request such as:-
"Nice to have one day"
"Would save lots of time in my average working day"
"I won't buy your product until you include this"
etc. etc.

For new products, FW update and SW updates I'd really encourage TT to adopt this method.

Cheers,

Owen S.
Last edited by Owen Sparks aka Marksman on Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:07 pm

That's a good idea, but whether or not TT take it up is entirely up to them. I figure they'll read what we write and consider which goals they like and can be easily implemented, which they like, but require effort, and which they aren't really considering. Feedback is important, so if we don't know which ideas they are considering, it makes it difficulty to express one they are dropping that we really want.

29) Fill in holes and print hollow objects as solid in UPStudio. Either this or include a pre-processing module or tool so we can perform the required editing to make it work. Since they add adding some editing capability into the tool anyway...

30) Include a persistent option to open UPStudio in the minimum sized window as opposed to full screen, which is really annoying when you have a 4K monitor.

BigE79
Posts: 40
Joined: Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:18 pm

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by BigE79 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:26 am

@cj7hawk
Yep know about activating the light from the touch panel but it's not obvious and not in the manual.
ABS+ is a stronger ABS, this is also a genuine Tiertime filament. I think it contains more Polycarb but it's also more expensive.

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:00 pm

31) Lights Out option from the panel.

32) Manage the UP300 queue from the Tiertime software ( so I don't get constantly asked do I want to print some model I haven't printed for months everytime the current print finishes ) - Also want to be able to delete stuff from the UP300 memory from the PC, rather than the hugely painful panel-only options. Or at least give me a "clear everything" option.

TiertimeBrook
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2018 8:25 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by TiertimeBrook » Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:36 am

Hello Owen,

Thanks for your kindly suggestion, I will report the suggestions to software department for their reference.

Best Regards
Brook

lindagrham21
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:11 pm

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by lindagrham21 » Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:14 pm

Hey! this is a great discussion on this topic, it's a very helpful post, if anyone any idea about of this install hp envy 4500 printer please share your view. :?:

cadcam
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 3:03 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cadcam » Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:54 pm

Been reading throught the 'would like for list' and it seems that (3), (4) and (19) could posisbly be solved by one unit that can feed, (retract?), wipe, detect motion . Still thinking of buying a 300, but do owners think there may be space to put a small unit in and possibly link (replace?) the out of filament sensor. If no user external stop is available could the out of filament connection be 'borrowed'? It may also need a coil or something around the extruder motor cable to monitor filament extrude demand?

Or has this already been done by an user?

Best Wishes

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 564
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Thu Mar 07, 2019 5:32 pm

Hi cadcam.

Not that I'm aware of.

Actually there are 32 suggestions here from the last 4 months, it'd be interesting to know how many have been addressed?

Cheers, Owen S.

cadcam
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 3:03 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cadcam » Thu Mar 07, 2019 6:35 pm

Certainly as a potential repeat/returning purchaser of UP/Tiertime products it would really nice to see feedback from Tiertime , ideally with realistic timescales, and/or get the user community involved in moving things on.
I guess there is a feeling that the Mini2/300 should be different from the original 1 Plus and be more complete out of the box, but perhaps with such a wide user base not everything can be expected to be covered initially. However, if the enthusiastic users could be harnessed community/company should be able to benefit from a very fast concept/development/testing/release cycle for 'improvements'/additional features. The robustness of the base design of the machines means that the machines are often used in schools/universities where there is often significant student resource to assist in undetaking 'testing'.

The lack of documented feedback from Tiertime is certainly making me think hard about buying an new 300. Perhaps it shouldn't but to a academic establishment the costs are significant and confidence that the support is going to be there is very important.

I would love to see the through put on this forum more lick it is seen on some other manufacturers sites, both from the users and the company. Slow responses leads to primarily negative feedback, fast a vibrant leads to good articles and much more on the successes and how to do interesting things, e.g. I would really like to see a design guid for using the UP300, with tables of material properties in different build conditions, expected accuracies, surfaces finishes . Databases of 3rd party filament setups with pros/cons etc. Or are this type of material being published on an alternative forum (I have seen that with some other manufacturers)?

Regards

cadcam
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 3:03 am

Question re Spool holder

Post by cadcam » Fri Mar 08, 2019 4:03 pm

Can I confirm the spool holder doesn't weigh the spool?

If not could an owner or Tiertime indicate if the spool holder is demountable
so could be replaced by a support with a loadcell included? [Is this something that Tiertime might include in upgrades?]

I notice on the UP300 pictures the spools have a slot with a visual scale of how much
filament is left. Is this feature now on all UP filament? [The spools I have do not have the slot, but I am working through a large
stock from a year or more ago]

Many Thanks

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:54 am

The spool holder definitely doesn't weigh the spool. It does appear easy enough to remove though - just some bolts into captive nuts. I've been thinking about making my own spool holder also since the one in the UP300 pretty much sucks... I've even thought about making one with a mechanism to automatically feed the filament... Should be possible.

The space around the spool holder is big enough for a 1Kg spool, at least of the sort I've been working with... And the door closes OK, but I figure when (if) they bring out the dual-print head, I may have to remove the door and put both spools in there, as well as putting in two feed lines.

But I don't think modifying the spool cabinet, including the spool holder, is going to prove difficult at all. At least not in my opinion.

I can take photos of the system and post them if you like?

cadcam
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 3:03 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cadcam » Tue Mar 12, 2019 3:31 pm

Many Thanks for the feedback.

It might be a fun project to build a replacement holder with

1) Filament Feed (Retraction?)
2) Spool (filament) weight
3) Measurement of spool movement (to detect filament blocking) - Perhaps more difficult than putting it ont he head, but would keep the accelerated mass down.
(4) Filament cleaning/wiping)


Dear Tiertime - If a replacement system was developed would you consider give the community access to power pick-up points, signal input pts etc without destroying any warranty?

With hope for a definative answer : I notice the mention of a dual headed extruder again. Is this really on the list of future upgrades for the UP300? If yes, when is it likely and will it include the software option of using dual sized nozzles to give accurate surfacing and rapid infill?

Best Wishes

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:01 pm

I'd suggest distance over weight, as the weight can vary by 10% easily by moisture content alone, and I've seen as much as 15% during some experiments I did with an autoclave measuring moisture loss in autoclaved ABS models... ( It's amazing, but heating up an ABS model in steam to 120% or so removes ALL of the moisture in the ABS ).

But distance is a better measure since most rolls are sold in meters rather than weight.

Filament wiping? Absolutely ! I have to agree with that one... Definitely worthwhile.

I've taken my UP300 apart once already, and both the vendor and UP were pretty supportive. I don't think it would be too hard to tap power and other requirements for a standalone mod, but it would be better if they provided software to let us use RS-232 or something for an external information feed so it could drop back into modules loaded with the Tiertime software.... Kind of like a user bus. And they would have spare RS-232 ports inside that could be activated via firmware.

Now, given how many Makers use the tech, that would be a HUGE advantage commercially to Tiertime if they did that -

Good idea.

33) Add a user bus interface for additional mods... :) Take advantage of your community and enfranchise them :) :D :D :D

David

cadcam
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon May 26, 2014 3:03 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cadcam » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:30 pm

Weight is useful as it is what most supplier, inc Tiertime, use to predict usage on a model. The final correlation must be quite reasonable as the extruder is driven on length (e.g. nominal voume) rather than exact weight. It should be able to correlate the two with a loadcell and filament takeoff measurement, if measurement non-volatile through power switching, then may be able to give warning of moisture take-up as well!

Filament measurement better off the head. Traditionally done with a wheel, has anyone had experience of optical velocity measurement systems on filaments re accuracy?

I wonder if Tiertime have a spare I2C port inside the 300?
This could make a really nice interface for user hardware modules. If you used something like a Pic12F1840 (or Arduino) you would have Analogue i/p, plenty of mips, software definable I2C address to fit Tiertime's user adjustable trip/control variable ;-). [Really like the idea of downloadable modules]
(If not as sophisticated, at least a few protected dig i/o pins ? ;-()

More complicated addons are appearing on user/diy systems, but the thought of being able to do it on a robust system like a 300 sounds like opening up lots of interesting undergraduate projects . (Tongue in cheek - Once the second head drive is available , a well defined API which gives the user access to outputs as well opens up all those interesting projects like laser enhancement of fibre joint, variable complient structures but retaining the surface quality of Tiertime.

If Tiertime could support the community in adding features**, I think you are correct the community would embrace it. Also the UP300 would start to make a greater appearance in Makespaces etc where now high an Prusas/clones are being used to develop novel techniques.

** If I remember correctly in the era of the first UP Pluses input from a few from the community was accepted by Tiertime.

Best Wishes

cj7hawk
Posts: 95
Joined: Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:52 am

Re: Upgrades and Firmware revisions we'd like for the UP300

Post by cj7hawk » Sun Mar 17, 2019 3:56 am

cadcam wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:30 pm
if measurement non-volatile through power switching, then may be able to give warning of moisture take-up as well!
This much is true, but it is complicated and relies on accurate spool measurements during initial spooling, as well as knowing the moisture content at the point of opening. Consistency by length is far more accurate, and Tiertime don't need optical use measuring - The feed mechanism alone is very accurate and allows determination of how much spool usage has occured.

Where this fails, especially with the UP300, is in changing spools. The system has no idea how much filament is left, or any way of recording filament use when changing materials - eg, moving from ABS to PLA. This is a huge failure of the system, and at best you could work around by measuring filament use and recording it on a sticker on the side of the spool each time you derack the spool.

Weight would let you know when you're reaching the spool weight, if corrections were used, but that's only minimalistic in accuracy. As I said, weight varies by 20%. Only length and diameter are suitable methods for accurate measurement, and feed rate is probably the best thing to use, as Tiertime has done.

There are practical problems in measuring filament weight too, but that aside, there's no reason it shouldn't be supported as a community mod for those who want it, and Tiertime should support community mods.

I disagree on I2C though. Giving access to the I2C bus would be a security problem, and would result in potential for community mods to affect machine operation, which is a problem. Better to just use Serial, without a bus, so that it can be necessarily protected from interfering with the printer operation. RS232 is pretty common for such applications, even at TTL level, which most chips support anyway, and a low baud rate such as 9600 baud can be universally implemented on any processor based solution.

Feeding that back into an API from the Tiertime software is a little more complex, but could still be useful. Even a message display showing incoming messages from the printer via the 3rd party interface would be useful since it simplifies things.

Tiertime do, however, tend to monopolize their own products to quite an extent. They really do make them incompatible with most third party solutions.

As for monitoring filament feed, the main reason I can see for doing that is to confirm that the filament hasn't jammed. That doesn't require anything complex, and a small encoding wheel is fine for that. With a third-party interface, the same system could also track usage, and would potentially allow for "cassettes" of filament, so that characteristics such as print settings, temperature and remaining filament could be transferred to the Tiertime app on loading the cassette.

This would greatly improve multi-filament operation and support changing of filaments.

Regards
David

Post Reply