UP Box review

Share your experience with UP BOX and UP BOX+
m_bergman
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:06 am

UP Box review

Post by m_bergman » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:19 am

Box review Pt 1
Now that I've had the Box for a few weeks and are more or less used to it, a brief review.

Firstly, this thing is huge. 50cmx50cmx50cm. The shipping box is even bigger...
It needs its own desk to sit on. (Some household members are claiming it needs its own room...)
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All the case is plastic.
The front door feels rigid, and has metal hinge arms. Opening this apparently stops the printer. (Note that it opens sideways to the left, so you need another 50cm free space for the door.)
The top lid feels a bit flimsy. You can open this without stopping the printer.
You have to put a large sticker with (very necessary) instructions inside the lid.
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Be aware that the sticker needs to be trimmed a few mm to fit in the recess provided.

Why are the instructions necessary? Because of the 3-button control panel, which has 9 functions. Now I rapidly found that opening the lid to find out which button to push was stupid, so I grabbed a picture from the manual and laminated a quick-ref panel and stuck it to the side of the printer.
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I *STRONGLY* recommend you do something similar if your memory is anything like mine. For example, I managed to STOP (permanantly) a print instead of turn on the lights by pushing the button a bit too long. Note to self - always turn on lights before starting print.
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Internal construction is very different from the Plus. The table moves vertically only. The head moves in X and Y on two pair of rods. Everything seems more professionally made that the Plus, except the seemingly obligitory 3d-printed head shrouds.
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On the view of the head above, you can see the height-sensor probe in its retracted position. When you do a height-set, the arm flips down 90 degrees and is a touch probe. No messing about with extra plug in cables (that often don't seem to plug in properly). At the back of the table is the nozzle height sensor plate, also fully wired in.
Most of the cables are armoured, and also the feed tube.
I'm told the filter makes a difference from a fumes-emitted point of view. ( I wouldn't know because I have hardly no sense of smell.)
However I did find that the filter fan, mounted in a large flimsy plastic panel, caused the bottom of the side panel to buzz. (Fixed with a small plastic packer down the bottom to prevent vibration.)

Continued below in pt2 (due more pictures.) Please don't post here until I have all the bits up

m_bergman
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:06 am

Re: UP Box review

Post by m_bergman » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:53 am

Pt2

The table has a bunch of upstanding countersunk-head screws, which hold down the plate.
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The plate has keyhole shaped slots, and there are two ball-bearing type spring catches. You put on the plate and push it back 5mm to lock it. To release, pull on the back edge towards you. It is important to make sure all the screws have gone into their holes, or else you can get a disastrous bulge in the plate, which isn't always totally obvious. I tend to quickly run my finger over each one to check they're all in place. At first I had real problems getting the plate off, but seem to have it sorted now.
The Box comes with 4 plates. I guess they might be considered a consumable, because the raft does stick hard on bigger items, and they will get worn from the sharp scraper. One of my plates I will have to adjust, because the counterbore in the centre is too shallow and the screw head sits slightly proud.

Here's a comparison of the Box and Plus build plates:
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The air vent is nicer that the Plus version, and more obvious whether it's open or not.
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So far, all pretty good.
Now a couple of things that aren't so good.

The head is held on with 3 magnets. I know that this is a safety feature to prevent fatal head crashes, but it isn't as rigid as I'd like. Certainly not in the class of my milled head mount on my Plus, anyway. Print quality is about identical to an unmodified Plus, so this may not bother most people. I however will be considering alternate mounting solutions.
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The spools are my big gripe with this machine. 500g spools on a bigger printer? This is madness. And it's even more galling when it becomes obvious the only reason for it is to sell more (higher priced) spools.
The spools are the same diameters as the 700g ones, just 8mm narrower. You can't tell me there wasn't room for another 8mm in that recess, because that's totally bogus. This was a deliberate decision.

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The new spools have cutouts in the side to let you gauge how much is left, because you can't see that in the recess. The centre has a couple of recessed clips to hold the reel, which is the other difference to the old spool.

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The cover is held on with magnets.

I needed to do several large black parts for work, and 500g black spools aren't available yet, so I needed a work-around.
Turns out that the old spool sits on the spindle quite happily, but tries to fall out when it rotates. And due to the thickness difference, the door don't fit.

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The solution was obviously to space out the door, with 10mm worth of magnets

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That worked fine.

Continued Pt3

pleppik
Posts: 336
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 2:14 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by pleppik » Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:24 am

This is awesome info! Thanks!

One question: Is it possible to install a temperature mod on the extruder, or have the locked that down/sealed that up?

m_bergman
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:06 am

Re: UP Box review

Post by m_bergman » Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:27 am

Pt 3

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So, how does it rate?
I haven't tried Turbo mode, so can't comment.
At normal speed, print time is identical to the Plus.

The first few prints, I was convinced that the plastic was different. The parts seemed much more rigid, better bonded, and harder to get off the build plate ( and supports.)
However when I used the black roll mentioned above, I had exactly the same results. So the plastic is the same, but it prints very differently, obviously due to the enclosure.

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Quality is identical to that from my unmodified Plus ( but not as good as my modified one), but with much better layer adhesion and much better flatness. For example, on some of my 1/100 tanks, the gun barrels curl up a bit on the Plus, but are straight off the Box.

This 150mm test part would not have been flat off the Plus:

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Some of the laciness is due to the (faulty) part design, which is why I was testing it... the infill is certainly on par to an unmodified Plus.

Did a run of 9 frame-like parts for a customer, who has had many previous prototypes of it (up to v11 now...) from the Plus. Got an email back "Trial run went very well with no leaking (almost too good, what has changed?)", so the parts were flatter than previously.
( I found that you have to heat to at least 75 degrees to ensure a good raft adhesion.)

My conclusions:
A good machine if you need bigger or flatter parts, and can afford it.

Good points:
Better layer adhesion and part strength
Turbo mode for quicker prototypes
Big build area
Build quality
Filter

Bad points:
Confusing control panel
Small spool capacity ( and more expensive material)

The magnetic head will be an issue for some of us, but not for everyone by any means.

In final conclusion, I've ordered one for work.

As for the spools, it looks like everyone buying premium filament will be able to enjoy the 'benefits' of the smaller size soon, since they've stopped selling 700g white here...

gordon37
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:59 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by gordon37 » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:07 pm

Thanks for the effort!
I have ordered one 4 weeks ago but no good news yet.

Have you tried the software temp mod yet?
here: http://pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=54781

Taylor-Designs
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:32 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: UP Box review

Post by Taylor-Designs » Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:51 pm

Hi All,

This is my first 3D printer, so don't have any experience to give a useful stand alone review. I hope the OP doesn't mind, but I might throw my observations in here.

I received the printer, unboxed it and started printing very quickly, with no prior 3D printing experience. The 500g white roll worked perfect. The auto table alignment and nozzle height setting all worked perfectly. I was printing useful things in no time.

The software could do with improving, it would be good if the software showed the supports that it plans on using. It would be good to hit a button and it to estimate the time and material usage before you hit the go button. If you hit stop on a print (because it's bigger and longer than you thought) it counts the full estimated printed mass and deducts that from the estimated amount remaining on the roll (I guess the printer doesn't feed back how much it actually used). So you have to manually reset the roll amount if you stop a print.

I put in a 700g blue roll. Without paying much attention it appears to fit and for me the magnetic cover even went on, I didn't have to add magnets like above. The problem is the print kept failing part way through because the material would stop feeding. The larger roll doesn't fit past the clip parts of the standard spool holder, so it doesn't spin freely. My magnetic cover was probably rubbing too. The results is the spool doesn't rotate freely and filament feed stops mid print.

The local supplier has stl files for 2 spool holders that can be printed and used for larger spools. They are both rather crude and just extend a pole out the side using the existing spool shaft. I didn't like the look of them, they are here;
http://3dprintingsystems.com/support/updates/

Instead grabbed 5 pencils, 2 old skateboard wheel bearings and printed myself a spool roller and brackets to make a pencil stand spool reeler. I know use it for the 500g and bigger 700g spools. The spool rotates very easily, hopefully it will minimise dust and wear on the filament feeding wheel.

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Now blue works fine. I can reliably print big things. This took 28hrs, used 280g of filament. This is the bottom, the top is client specific so I won't show it. It is a large part, nice and straight, no warping.

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m_bergman
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:06 am

Re: UP Box review

Post by m_bergman » Thu Jun 04, 2015 11:29 pm

You can get a time and material estimate in the 3D Print menu, print preview.

Your feed problems with the door on were because the door was tight against the spool (and not quite touching the case).
I don't really want to have to use an external spool holder - the machine takes up enough room already.

Taylor-Designs
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:32 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: UP Box review

Post by Taylor-Designs » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:19 am

You'll still have more rubbing than the 500g roll. The 500g roll goes over the lips on the retaining fingers of the standard orange spool holder. The black covers doesn't do any retaining.

With your arrangement the 700g spool will slide in and out and touch the black cover/door. The lips of the standard retaining fingers will also be digging into the inside of the spool and making it harder to turn.

Even after running the 500g roll I had bits of the black plastic shavings sitting on the spool holder and edges of the retaining fingers. Look for that when you change rolls of filament.

LonV
Posts: 220
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:53 pm
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA

Re: UP Box review

Post by LonV » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:38 am

Is there anything preventing me from having a glass bed (I know, I know, I'm crazy...but I love having one on my Up Plus)? Like are there metal contacts that are on the board for bed leveling that would prevent me from doing this?

I'd love to order one...but no idea how to. :D

Thanks!

-Lon

Taylor-Designs
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:32 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: UP Box review

Post by Taylor-Designs » Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:59 am

Thanks for the tip on print preview. I clicked on it earlier and thought it just went to the normal print. But if you continue it does give an estimate without actually printing. It then does show the raft, but it still doesn't show supports.

pp3dp.nl
Posts: 252
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:18 pm
Location: Holland/The Netherlands

Re: UP Box review

Post by pp3dp.nl » Fri Jun 05, 2015 7:32 pm

LonV wrote:Is there anything preventing me from having a glass bed (I know, I know, I'm crazy...but I love having one on my Up Plus)? Like are there metal contacts that are on the board for bed leveling that would prevent me from doing this?

I'd love to order one...but no idea how to. :D

Thanks!

-Lon
There is a height sensor but that is out of the print area. The screws for the perf board are removable so glass with binder clips is possible I think.

LonV
Posts: 220
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:53 pm
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA

Re: UP Box review

Post by LonV » Sat Jun 06, 2015 6:29 am

Sweet!

juancr
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:19 am
Location: Spain
Contact:

Re: UP Box review

Post by juancr » Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:45 pm

Great review!!
Regards,
JuanCR
(You should know I do my best with my written english ;-) )

RobGer
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:33 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by RobGer » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:31 am

Thanks for taking the time to write this review & looking forward to see more of your prints.

Rob.

jamesmo
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:13 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by jamesmo » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:31 pm

Just received the Up Box recently and up and running. It's very easy to set up and install. I decided to get right into it and threw on some heart stls from an MRI scan. Silky smooth inside but I was too ambitious with avoiding support on the underside which ended up very rough. Print quality looks good overall however. What supports I had were hard to remove- will need to investigate various options.
As stated above the perf board was very hard to remove the first time- I ended up removing it by grabbing the printed model and pulling it forward and up.

A major issue with the Up Box which I had not anticipated is that there are big holes spaced across the perf board, over which it is impossible to print. I.e. you cannot print across the whole build space. I had seen that the software identifies the holes underneath the model and colours them orange. There is no warning that the print will fail and I had thought perhaps there was some funky software that built a raft over the holes, but no- it just tries to print over the holes, squirts ABS into them, the print fails etc.

Tiertime- can't you supply some plugs (or plug files for us to print) to cover the holes and enable the entire build space to be useable?
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Taylor-Designs
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:32 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: UP Box review

Post by Taylor-Designs » Sat Jun 13, 2015 11:42 am

How many problems have you had with the holes in the perf board?

I have done a few prints which go over the holes, all of them were fine. It didn't care about the little holes. You can see the blue print in my photo above, it took up nearly the whole print area and went over multiple screws. I didn't have any problems.

jamesmo
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Jul 07, 2013 12:13 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by jamesmo » Sun Jun 14, 2015 1:22 pm

It only failed twice- and I assumed it was the holes but will keep trying. I had wondered how the large prints were done. So far, the ABS does seem to be squirted into the hole so I can't see how areas above it will be built. It has also stopped extruding shortly after going over the holes (nozzle blocked perhaps). I am blaming the holes here but perhaps it is not the case. I also have a feeling that the auto nozzle height adjustment puts the nozzle a little too close to the perf board.

uplus2user
Posts: 62
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 11:36 am

Re: UP Box review

Post by uplus2user » Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:11 am

Hi guys, can you use the 3D printer to print some holes to fill in the gaps?

uplus2user
Posts: 62
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2015 11:36 am

Re: UP Box review

Post by uplus2user » Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:20 am

What is the minimum diameter that this printer could do to make nice screw holes? I use screws from M3 and up but I am also interested in making smaller holes in future project.

gordon37
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2015 12:59 pm

Re: UP Box review

Post by gordon37 » Tue Jun 16, 2015 12:19 pm

I have no issue with the holes so far, all prints passing the hole with raft briging on top of it.
maybe your nozzle height is too high?

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