Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post improvements made for UP, and share ideas.
bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:25 pm

Edit: Config.zip attached to this post; will update as progress is made. Use at your own peril.
config.zip
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[/i]
So I'm throwing out the Tiertime electronics and installing a Duet maestro instead, and as I've come up with a plan that so far doesn't require soldering or modifications of existing hardware I figured I'd share the progress. Still need to work out ethernet and power wiring into the case. After the basic electronics are replaced and found working satisfactory I will replace the hotbed, and likely the linear rails as some of my plastic clips holding the smooth rods broke.

The main reasons this requires no modifications to existing hardware is
PanelDue + 4.3" LCD can be screwed in with 2 of 4 screws from existing LCD.
FPC cable to heated bed can be connected to FPC adapter link below.
All motors and sensors can be connected to Duet via adapter wires from original XH2.54 or 2x8 ribbon.
Duet PT100 daughter board support existing thermistors.

Do not solder crimp connectors, get the reasonably priced IWISS-2412M / IWISS-2820M crimper. Or Engineer PA-09 which is a little more pricy, but better quality, they'll crimp pretty much anything you'll ever need to crimp as a hobby electronics nerd. Its possible to buy the male XH2.54 complete with 26AWG wire, but I think this is too thin for motors and fans so I'll be making my own 22AWG or so.

The adapters will work with cheaper RAMPS electronics as well, but requiers another PT100 amplifier solution.

BoM (work in progress):
Last edited by bjorn on Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:00 pm, edited 11 times in total.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:28 pm

Pictures showing the LCD mounted. Print a 1-2mm spacer and its a perfect fit. File out the PCB 1mm or so and secure with two last screws as well.

The PanelDue board needs the 40 pin extension and a custom mount to be designed and printed, as it prevents the front LCD panel to be closed when mounted straight on the LCD.

Update: There is also a 4.3" LCD panel with integrated PanelDue, but while the mounting holes are the same it will require making changes to the original front bezel as the pcb would extend past the spacing in the ribs for the existing LCD.
Attachments
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Last edited by bjorn on Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 610
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:50 am

Interesting. Looks like this could "free" TT printers.

I've not dealt with "Duet" but was a little concerned that they're shut for 3 weeks due to vacation, and that most of what I looked at was out of stock. Are they a legitimate company?

Cheers, Owen S.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Mon Feb 25, 2019 1:29 pm

For me it was Smoothieboard or Duet - and the Duet community just seems to be in the open source spirit and the Smoothieboard borderline arogant. The Duet devs seems to always be active on the forums, so the firmware support is second to none - can't say anything about the hardware support but its built to last with protections you just don't find on other boards. They do list a bunch of authorized reselles, but I didn't check stock there. The low stock is likely because they're launching a new product after the vacation if I'm not mistaken.

(The only reason I bought a clone is for import taxes, taxes alone make a much bigger difference than clone vs genuine, and from china odds are the tax declaration is, incorrect. After importing the genuine board would be twice the price of the clone, despite the difference only being $30).

However, you can use even the cheapest RAMPS board if you don't mind loosing touch screen and ethernet or wifi. There are amplifier boards to make PT100 thermistors work with normal RAMPS style boards, and all the other adapters for wires I will make and post can be adapted to whatever the target board needs. The key components are the male XH headers and the FPC adapter.

If other also need to replace the bed then it becomes more involved, and I'm not 100% sure how I'll go about that. But having measured the bed to be 15W its clear that it'll never work, and while at it it needs to have leveling feature. (Suppose a boost converter and an external mosfet in line with the FPC cable using two FPC adapters and a short ribbon would allow us to increase the power delivered without too much intrusive changes - but not sure I think thats a good idea with respect to rigidity and power supply)

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 610
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:59 pm

Thanks for your reply Bjorn, appreciate your time.
O.S.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Fri Mar 01, 2019 5:34 pm

You're welcome Owen. If you want to do the absolutely cheapest, yet viable, option then a MKS Gen L or what its called (single board ramps clone) + Orange Pi Zero running Octo print (not Octo Pi) will give you a very functional system; and you can choose how much $ to put into the stepper drivers, from the cheapest A94xx to something like UP use, the DRV82xx or all the way to silent bliss with TMC2xxx. (With the low power bed and extruder the saftey worries of those cheap boards should not be an issue, they can handle 5A).

My always faulty Chinesium Delta uses that setup, with Trinamic 2130 drivers, and apart from it always needing a new feature and never quite getting the accuracy I'm looking for the electronics work great, and near silent.

I still chose the Duet now that they released the Maestro which is the cheaper version (as opposed to the beefier boards that can run small CNC routers etc) because from that I hear it-just-works(tm) which was the whole reason to buy the Mini 2 instead of a core xy kit from China. I would have liked to have both printers on Octo Print, just because its so convenient, but the Duet Web Ui accomplishes the same thing just different experience.

Anyways, hoping to test fit the board and get first motion tomorrow. Stoked.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Fri Mar 01, 2019 9:48 pm

Realized the motor pin out and pin spacing were the same so they plug straight in, end stops needed an adapter but quick work.

Need to print som parts to hold test indicator to verify steps/mm and stuff, but so far so good.

X/Blue (moves bed in/out): 110step/mm, Backwards, Active high/NC limit switch at Xmin.
Y/Red (moves extruder left/right): 110step/mm, Backwards, Active high/NC switch at Ymin
Z/Yellow (moves bed up/down): 110step/mm, Backwards, Active high/NC switch at Zmax


It can home, and move to soft limits. Next step work out what voltage fans, leds, beds, heaters etc are getting and wire it up.
Worth noting that Trinamic drivers will not run these silently at 12v (maybe can be tweaked, but 12v was louder than original hardware). When running off 24V they are virutally silent, will upload video comparing homing sequence soon(tm)

Hotend Heater (presume 19v/measured 8.2ohm*)
Hotend Fan (rated 5v 0.2A)
Hotend LED 5v
Bed Heater (presume 19v/measured 14.1 ohm@20C, 18.5ohm@75C .**)
Case LED 19v
Case FAN (rated 24v 0.3A)
Motors: 400 steps, 25ohm, 30uH, 0.4A (inductance measured, current best guess)

* Same as below more or less. 24V means 70W instead of 44W to heater.
** Feeding it 24v will yield 1.7A/40W but too much for the FPC cable. Can go up to 20V if you use the two conductors for the z-height. 4*0.5A = 2A. Derate to 70% and get 1.4A/28W which is still twice the original power. Might work, but if reverting to soldering then adding some nice thick gauge silicone wire is better. Still need to determine where the drop from 19V to 14.4V occurs on my printer to make a recommendation for supply voltage if not making any changes.


Bed FPC pinout: (maybe reversed)
1+2 Z height probe
3+4 PT 100
5-7 heater +
8-10 heater -

FPC front panel pinout (useless after upgrade)
gnd
gnd
gnd
nc
txd
rxd
nc
5v
5v
5v

FPC the other one pinout:
LED 19v
LED -
Door sensor 1
Door sensor 2/Switch NC
Door sensor 3
Switch NO
Switch COM
LED R-
LED RB+ 5v
LED B-

One thing I'll give them credit for, proper bonding. Main board has a 1x5 header with all leads going to the metal chassis. Which I can only assume means the external power brick isn't actually isolated but ground referenced. Interesting choice!

Thats about as far as I'll get until the PT100 board and the FPC adapters arrive. Doable to print mounting adapter to go between the old board mounting holes and the Duet mounting. But it will be a challenge to get power and ethernet in through the unmodified rear panel, only option seems to be cables and grommets through existing holes and external connectors or even permanent fixed length leads.
Attachments
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Last edited by bjorn on Fri May 10, 2019 11:09 pm, edited 7 times in total.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Video comparison of homing operations. So quiet!

Post by bjorn » Sat Mar 02, 2019 3:53 pm

Motor noise comparison; video with green replacement idler is original Up motherboard. Grey idler part is with the Duet 2 Maestro.

Probably need headphones to really tell the difference, but that is what I expect when someone markets a printer as "very quiet" ... if you want it done right, and all that.. :)

Uhm, cannot upload video? Suppose google photos will have to do then https://photos.app.goo.gl/f8iBrXsDapmjif6X7
Last edited by bjorn on Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sat Mar 02, 2019 5:11 pm

Code: Select all

X    Z   
 60  0.369  0.220  0.039 -0.125
 30  0.295  0.152  0.042  0.006
  0  0.137  0.185  0.154  0.140
-30  0.140  0.155  0.201  0.258
-60  0.000  0.100  0.212  0.352
  Y    -45    -15     15     45
Quick mapping of bed while electronics were under Duet control. 30x30mm grid, 0,0 is in center of bed, limited Y to -45 to 45 to avoid colisions with indicator. Biggest difference is about 0.5mm; look forward to 3 point adjustment to get bed level.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sat Mar 02, 2019 10:48 pm

I know I kinda said the brain transplant would be non intrusive, be carefull when unplugging them connectors..!
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Crimping male XH2.54mm and female KF2510 pins on silicone wire, nylon housings, a touch of permanent marker to match the colour coding, and the limit switches have plug and play adapters! Quite eager to get the PT100 board and FPC adapters now. Think I have a plan for the 3-point leveling of the bed but unsure if the current PCBs are rigid enough.
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bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:09 am

Decided I could print an adapter for regular single dupont wires to fit the 16pin ribbon cable; I'll give the Up Mini that, when it works, it works well.. Will use adapter to measure out what voltage the heater, led, fan and other things in the extruder get. ... forum doesn't allow .stl files either?
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Also finished the adapters for the motors. Green one is extruder which will get male dupont header and go into the printed adapter above - just control board side of things of course. Cut all wires exactly the same length to avoid squigly looking adapters like the red one, 0.5mm makes a difference.
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Getting closer, but still have to wait for the PT100 board to start making failed prints.
Last edited by bjorn on Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:12 pm

Decided to double check the pin out for the print head PCB i've seen here before. Seems the Mini 2 has a slightly different layout. But as mentioned in the heated bed thread, I don't think the wiring can handle the move to 24V, so I need to use the original power supply once I get the heat running.

Edit: Will upload new sketch, this one has a flaw.

Top 3-pin is fan.
Left 4-pin is heater/PT100
Middle 2-pin is LED
Bottom 4-pin is extruder motor.
IMG_20190303_165336831.jpg
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Last edited by bjorn on Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Time to decide on supply voltage!

Post by bjorn » Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:08 pm

12v not happening, nosy motors, under powered heaters
19v only have original Up power supply that will deliver 19v
24v the good stuff!

At first glance it seems both the bed and the hot end would about double their power if the voltage was increased to 24v. For the hot end this is a bit much (70W), the bed would be usable at 40W. However the original wiring cannot support the increased current (as the resistance in the heaters does not change, current increases with voltage) ... and the bed is resting on ABS (for now) so not sure how hot I want it.

Reprap firmware have some awesome safety features and should allow me to run the "overpowered" heaters at 24V but at a limited duty cycle for the control loop. And with different settings for each I can push the bed a little past its puny 14-15W and leave the hot end at 40-ish watt on average. Both being restive components they can take the extra voltage.

I'm also contemplating that there are two unused wires going to the print head (but it carries 3.3V so if used as a 3rd wire for the heater, it would damage the original board if ever connected again). The same could be done with the bed, the auto z-height wires could be used as a 3rd wire for the bed to increase the power, but again with the risk of damage if connected to the original board.

I've run the motors at 24V. Fans and LEDs are rated for 24V so while they'll run faster and brighter than they did at 19V they'll be within specs (they could also be run off a limited duty cycle - but the rated voltage would stil be important as they are semiconductors). So I'm inclined to go with 24V for everything, and software limit the heaters until I decide how (somewhat safely) to increase the power past the original wattage, and tune fan/led to taste.

All the connections have been mapped and measured, all I need are some crimp terminals (ran out), the PT100 board to interface the fancy thermistors used in the Up Mini 2, and the flat panel adapter for the heat bed cable (stil not shipped from China after a week)

The end is near! (Or at least slowly approaching from China!)

(oh, yeah, still need to work out how to get cables into the chassis, but details details..)

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:48 pm

Print head adapter done (- the LED that is); tight fit with heavy gauge wire in the 0.1" header but it sure aint going to complain about the current..
(Duet has screw terminals for PT100 and Extruder, but I will replace with 3.96mm pluggable headers as they can handle the currents involved)

One more for the bed and we're in business, when customs decide to release the PT100 board..
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Model for this is on thingiverse:
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:3465278
Last edited by bjorn on Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Owen Sparks aka Marksman
Posts: 610
Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:24 pm

This is getting exciting.
Owen S.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:47 pm

Sure is ... and you can always count on customs to put a damper on excitement!

Reason I left out the *print head) LED is that it kinda makes using a (cheap) camera a bit difficult, so I'll start off without it. Its also partly because of the 4 fan outputs on the board 3 and 1 needs to be the same voltage, and the UP Mini 2 has 1x5V print head fan, 1x24V case fan, 1x5V print head LED and 1x24V case LED so I'll have to decide on which one of those to have as "always on" or maybe connect case fan and case LED to the same output.

For me the most exciting part was seeing the first steps (pun intended) and subsequently not hearing any steps, working out steps/mm, motor directions, limit switches and travel. The heating stuff is straightforward (with the exception of the platinum sensors requiring a fancy amplifier, which customs seems to be baffled by).

I will have some materials left over so I could provide a few kits of those adapters for pretty much the cost of materials and postage (mind you shipping from Norway will be a bit painful); and when its gone, its gone.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:31 pm

The board has arrived; the configuration is complete (minus the LEDS and switches). Sadly no more time to play, first print tomrrow if all goes according to plan!
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Owen Sparks aka Marksman
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Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:56 am

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by Owen Sparks aka Marksman » Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:15 pm

I'm liking the machine name.
Owen S.

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:50 pm

It accurately reflects my feeling towards the shop I bought the printer at.. :P
Warning: Heater 1 appears to be over-powered. If left on at full power, its temperature is predicted to reach 525C.
Auto tune heater 1 completed in 232 sec
Use M307 H1 to see the result, or M500 to save the result in config-override.g
I like the safety features in the firmware..! Hopefully the bed is similarly overpowered when I get time to test it

bjorn
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:00 pm

Re: Up! Mini 2 + Duet electronics! (Linear rails and real hotbed!)

Post by bjorn » Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:07 pm

bjorn wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 1:29 pm
OwenSparks wrote:
Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:50 am
... I've not dealt with "Duet" but was a little concerned that they're shut for 3 weeks due to vacation, and that most of what I looked at was out of stock. Are they a legitimate company? ..
-- can't say anything about the hardware support but its built to last with protections you just don't find on other boards...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyWolKFzb-A

Video from one of the devs, showing the board taking some abuse that would kill almost any other cheaper board at least.

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