PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

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45054
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 2:23 pm
Location: Saarland-Germany

PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by 45054 » Wed Jun 24, 2015 7:16 pm

Hey folks,

I have a Plus 2 for almost a half year now and it was running fine for that time, except for minor auto-height-detection issues, nothing that could keep me from printing ;)

I mainly print things that have a specific function, meaning: measurements and form-accuracy (as far as possible) are important to me.
After a lot of ABS and a lot of throwing away due to warping I decided to give PLA a try, because I heard it would be completely warp-free.

As long as I kept the prints relatively small, that worked out just fine, but as soon as I came to the bigger and therefore longer-to-print parts, the air printing began...and with it came that unpleasant klicking noise...

At first, I had no idea what that meant, but me being me, I observed closely before crying for help.
I got rid of the extruderblock-cover to have a closer look and by doing so I noticed that the motor that feeds the filament to the extruder was way too hot!
It was then, that I saw what that klicking was: on the back of the motor you can see the shaft, which is supposed to be turning counterclockwise (from that perspective) but with every klick, the shaft jumps a tiny bit clockwise and slowly turns back counterclockwise to make the next klick.
So, the feeder gear was jammed and the motor overheated...but I still didn't know what the problem was! Is the motor for some reason too weak? Do I have to get a new one?

That was, when I looked it up on the internet and found this forum. There are a lot of topics about this, saying that too high temperatures can soften the PLA too near the feeder gear, causing it to "mill" the filament at this point, filling the gear with molten plastic, which prevents the filament to be pulled down any further....horror storys basicly.
But if the material was too soft, wouldn't the motor just turn through it? Instead my feeder gear was seemingly immobilised!
Well, either way I dis-assembled the head to look what was going on and saw...nothing (luckily). The feeder gear was clean except for a few blue dust particles from my last ABS-print. Does that mean, that the temp was too low? I cleaned the nozzle and even the extruder-tube very thoroughly to make sure that it wasn't "just clogged with dust", but to no avail. Jamming and klicking returned immediately.

Now to the final question(s): Too hot, or too cold? Or does the temperature not matter in this issue? I already installed a temp-mod and will be working (or better: experimenting) on this problem in the next few days and keep you updated, but I would highly appreciate your opinion! If you already know something about this I didn't mention before, feel free to tell me, or to correct me, if I'm wrong somewhere!

Notes:
- I'm using black PLA from "NusNus"
- UP software v2.13 (maybe the default temperature for PLA doesn't fit to the filament I used?)
- Model: UP Plus 2(H)
- ROM: V6.090
- Firmware: V3.07
- Temp-mod: FixUp3D


Greetings from Germany! :)
Btw: I have a lot of experience with reading and listening to english, but writing still goes slow and feels arkward, so I apologise beforehand for any typos above ;)

And sorry for the ultralong post :D

mb20music
Posts: 375
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:35 am
Location: USA

Re: PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by mb20music » Tue Jul 07, 2015 6:20 am

I have an extruder cooling fan mod but found that it would only allow me to use some of the third-party PLA filament that I have purchased on eBay from various sellers. Some of the PLA would extrude at first but after a few minutes it would jam and stop extruding. However, even with the mod, I found that there were only a couple spools of filament that I could get to print for me. I gave up on the spools that I was having trouble with.

I just recently found out that many people that have other brands of 3D printers are also experiencing the same issues with some PLA and they have discovered that applying just a small amount of Canola cooking oil to the filament seems to solve the problem.

So, I went ahead and tried it and so far it seems to be working for me, I haven't done extensive testing yet. So far, I have found that two spools that kept getting jammed in the past don't jam up with the Canola oil.

You might want to give it a try and see it works for you. You can Google "PLA filament Canola oil" and you can find out more about it.

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DrewPetitclerc
Posts: 580
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2011 7:39 am
Location: Silicon Valley California
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Re: PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by DrewPetitclerc » Thu Jul 09, 2015 4:30 pm

This is the fix for all the issues of other types of filament in your UP Plus.
Also the Canola oil will build up in the barrel and nozzle and reduce then clog the plastics path.

http://www.pp3dp.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... =80#p41564
Drew Petitclerc
Petitclerc Designs
Owner/Senior Principal Designer, prototype, tooling and test equipment design and 3D printing
http://flash-graphics.deviantart.com/
http://www.thingiverse.com/DrewPetitclerc

yungamos
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2015 6:00 am

Re: PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by yungamos » Sun Jul 12, 2015 3:46 pm

Once, my UP! Plus also have similar problem with PLA - the filament doesn't melt completely and the stepper motor filament driving gear just cut a groove on the filament.

I then used PLA from another supplier, and the problem is solved.

I think the melting temperature of PLA from different suppliers vary.

Hope this is helpful.

roller
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:09 pm
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by roller » Mon Aug 03, 2015 7:31 am

yungamos wrote:Once, my UP! Plus also have similar problem with PLA - the filament doesn't melt completely and the stepper motor filament driving gear just cut a groove on the filament.

I then used PLA from another supplier, and the problem is solved.

I think the melting temperature of PLA from different suppliers vary.

Hope this is helpful.
Yes it does. Some soften at only 40 degrees Celcius while other can hold form up to 90C. In some brands the different colours will also have a different glass point.

mb20music
Posts: 375
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:35 am
Location: USA

Re: PLA extrusion problems-> only half solved

Post by mb20music » Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:48 pm

DrewPetitclerc wrote: Also the Canola oil will build up in the barrel and nozzle and reduce then clog the plastics path.

Oh really? I guess I have just been lucky then because this has not happened to me yet. LOL

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