Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Talk about anything.
Post Reply
User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:54 pm

Wow! The only printer to match this quality on the Make site is the Afinia.

http://vimeo.com/76560753

mb20music
Posts: 375
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 1:35 am
Location: USA

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by mb20music » Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:49 pm

WOW! that's great!

goopyplastic
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2012 5:53 am

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by goopyplastic » Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:50 am

The problem with the Make test, at least for the magazine the test is with the default printing parameters supplied with each printer. For a lot of the reprap printers this means no optimization, troubleshooting, tweaking were done. Many of the printers in the shootout with soso print quality on the make test print much better with optimized settings. An example of this would be trinitlabs mendelmax pro vs. the m2, technically there is very little different in technology and achievable print quality on these but the sample prints are wildly different.

As for the zeeprinter it will probably fall into the vaporware category like the pirate printer, I wish them luck but I just don't see how they are going to deliver.

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:08 am

I see. So... it's OK if a printer turns out absolutely crap prints, with sagging, crooked pillars and an unfinished arch with noodles hanging off it when it's used with its "default" settings? That's what buyers should expect as normal from machines costing hundreds or thousands of dollars?

pilotltd
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:40 am

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by pilotltd » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:13 am

JuliaDee wrote:Wow! The only printer to match this quality on the Make site is the Afinia.

http://vimeo.com/76560753
I don't think that's a particularly good print anyway considering it was done at 0.05mm per layer! The Up! is capable of better finished prints at 0.2mm :)

User avatar
wackojacko
Posts: 667
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:46 am
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by wackojacko » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:13 am

Would have been good to see it side on to see how much loopies there are, also in abs as I can't see a heated bed.
Bruce
http://www.3DPrintingSystems.com

Need help with your printer, check out our Youtube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/user/3dprinting ... /playlists

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:23 am

wackojacko wrote:Would have been good to see it side on to see how much loopies there are, also in abs as I can't see a heated bed.
The heated bed's not ready yet, but they will offer one as an option.

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:31 am

pilotltd wrote:
JuliaDee wrote:Wow! The only printer to match this quality on the Make site is the Afinia.

http://vimeo.com/76560753
I don't think that's a particularly good print anyway considering it was done at 0.05mm per layer! The Up! is capable of better finished prints at 0.2mm :)
That may be so, but have you seen results from other printers? Here's a typical one, from the LeapFrog:
Screen shot 2013-10-10 at 5.29.07 AM.jpg
Screen shot 2013-10-10 at 5.29.07 AM.jpg (112.31 KiB) Viewed 14193 times
Screen shot 2013-10-10 at 5.28.50 AM.jpg
Screen shot 2013-10-10 at 5.28.50 AM.jpg (69.22 KiB) Viewed 14193 times

User avatar
woofy
Posts: 118
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:09 pm

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by woofy » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:04 am

Crikey!
What is the source of the Leapfrog images?

I've just been looking around for a large volume printer and finally settled on the Ultimaker 2, but the Leapfrog was also a front runner. I eventually eliminated it because of all the forum complaints about the amount of noise it makes. If this is typical print quality then I've had a very narrow escape.
UP plus, Ultimaker2 & Raise N2+ Printers.

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 10:20 am

woofy wrote:Crikey!
What is the source of the Leapfrog images?

I've just been looking around for a large volume printer and finally settled on the Ultimaker 2, but the Leapfrog was also a front runner. I eventually eliminated it because of all the forum complaints about the amount of noise it makes. If this is typical print quality then I've had a very narrow escape.
I found those photos here:

http://creatrtips.freeforums.org/the-ma ... r-t51.html

They are from a creatr forum and not the official Make Magazine results, which I'm having trouble finding now, although I know I was looking at them just yesterday, grr. To be fair, there are a couple of photos showing slightly better quality farther down the page that I didn't notice at first, but still nowhere near Up (or Zim) quality.

I too looked at LeapFrog a year ago but one look at their forum was enough to keep me away. I checked in again a couple of months ago and things had not improved.

In my own quest for a larger-volume printer I had a qu-bd Revolution XL on order for 6 months but cancelled just before it shipped due to early user complaints and truly awful customer service. Still waiting for my refund, but in the meantime I've ordered a Zortrax and a gMax. I saw the Ultimaker 2 at MakerFaire and it looks like a nice machine. I like the Zortrax because it's got custom software that looks as if it makes easy-to-remove support, and I like the gMax because it's... huge!

pilotltd
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Jul 31, 2013 6:40 am

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by pilotltd » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:14 am

JuliaDee wrote:
pilotltd wrote:
JuliaDee wrote:Wow! The only printer to match this quality on the Make site is the Afinia.

http://vimeo.com/76560753
I don't think that's a particularly good print anyway considering it was done at 0.05mm per layer! The Up! is capable of better finished prints at 0.2mm :)
That may be so, but have you seen results from other printers? Here's a typical one, from the LeapFrog:
Yikes - looks like a leaping frog printed it.

I must admit I cringe looking at some of the stuff people post on Thingiverse - the quality is often mediocre or worse and if the quality wasn't as good or better than the Up! I wouldn't be happy.

Steve

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:23 am

Here's the Ultimaker (original) from the Make review:
sip4_roundup_torture_ultimaker.jpg
sip4_roundup_torture_ultimaker.jpg (92.49 KiB) Viewed 14185 times

User avatar
JuliaDee
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun May 06, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Connecticut
Contact:

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by JuliaDee » Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:30 am

Solidoodle.
sip4_roundup_torture_solidoodle.jpg
sip4_roundup_torture_solidoodle.jpg (100.62 KiB) Viewed 14183 times

roller
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:09 pm
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by roller » Thu Oct 10, 2013 12:23 pm

As goopyplastic said the torture test done with little tweaking was a little unfair in some senses for the open source/reprap based printers - they can do much better with tuning ... but I also think it was the point Make was trying to establish. It was a comparison of the out of the box experience of these printers for those with limited knowledge.

You often see any of these printers that use open source software and making beautiful prints but very few will do a great job out of the box. Almost none will do a good job on all types of prints without considerable tweaking for each. Any of the printers I make will do a much better job that any Up on the Make torture test with the default settings I supply them with and all in a 200 x 200 x 200 volume but that's what I tune it for.

Pretty much all these other printers can make a "great" torture test or whatever other print if you have the time. Once tuned they can make a great fist of about 80% pf prints in fact. But try anything really complex and you are on your own. This get less true every 3 months as the software gets smarter but we are still a long way off dealing with hard prints in an automated fashion with any aplomb.

Zim is just another reprap project based printer. It's still dependent on software like Slic3r for generating prints and as such is fundamentally no better and no worse than one of my printers ($450, two bits of MDF, a bunch on slides and some 3D printed bits for bigger volume, heated bed).

The reason I say all this - you guys live a charmed and sheltered life with an Up and sometimes I worry you don't know what a chore reprap printers can be ... then again maybe I'm just jaded having made and troubleshot so many :)

User avatar
woofy
Posts: 118
Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2012 8:09 pm

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by woofy » Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:56 pm

Just for comparison (and my own curiosity) I've printed the torture test on my UP.
White UP ABS is very hard to photograph, Whilst cropping and re-sizing in Photoshop I reduced the highlights to make the details more visible.
tt1.JPG
tt1.JPG (65.66 KiB) Viewed 14172 times
tt2.JPG
tt2.JPG (69.1 KiB) Viewed 14172 times
tt3.JPG
tt3.JPG (62.11 KiB) Viewed 14172 times
UP plus, Ultimaker2 & Raise N2+ Printers.

masada012
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:23 am

Re: Zim Does the Make Torture Test

Post by masada012 » Sat Aug 23, 2014 6:42 pm

I know that this is a really old topic but if any of you all have printed this part in the past, what kind of support settings have you used? I can't seem to get comparable results as the ones shown above. Any help would be appreciated.

Post Reply